[SPOILERS] Discussion Thr

Chatterbox: Inkwell

[SPOILERS] Discussion Thr

[SPOILERS] Discussion Thread for the story we're planning!

If you're not Hex or Flamarestii and don't want spoilers on our story, please don't read this thread!

Anyway, we can plan and discuss more here! 

submitted by Jaybells@Hex&Flame, age Obscure, Lost in the Universe
(February 15, 2022 - 8:42 am)

I love how you made Sky, Water, and Earth goddesses of like, the four elements. I was thinking since there's one more element, (fire) we could have it be a secret.

submitted by Rora@Jaybells
(August 24, 2022 - 12:28 pm)

Yea, that one's kinda tricky... I think we were kinda debating whether fire would be "born" of Earth and Sky (like the sun rising from the Earth into the sky), or of Sky and Water(as in lightning, which only happens when Sky and Water meet), or perhaps maybe only from Water, as a show of power in making something her complete opposite.

Maybe it could be a secretive, even more elusive 'Element' though!

Also, thinking about it a bit deeper, Fire could very well represent Earth and Sky and their feelings towards Water. Earth is horribly jealous of Water (perhaps subconsciously because she feels like Water could bring an end to her, just like water to a flame), while in a way fire may be seen as gravitating towards water, as it destroys Earth(and burns away the products/reminders of Earth+Water's relationship, which could be what Sky was originally upset about: plants, life, etc.) but halts at Water's side(since it has nothing to feed on, symbolically in a gesture of regret), to the point it would willingly lay down its life for her(letting itself be put out by Water), just like Sky. Very poetic! Not sure I like all the points I made up though, so lemme know your thoughts too!


Anyway, continuing on with that plant tidbit, maybe that's part of what made Earth so jealous; Plants (a combination of Earth and Water) would always grow away from Earth, and towards Water (who maybe used to be on top of Earth, before being dethroned by Sky). The only parts she was left with were the ugly, gangly little roots. It hurt for the half of her children towards Water to flourish, while her side didn't.

That also gets me thinking a bit more like a tela-novela, where Sky was basically pining for Water, who had a previous creative relationship with Earth. They're kinda jealous, but quietly try to win Water's favour. Slowly, it seems to be working, but Sky is still worried that they're not enough. Meanwhile, Earth, seeing Water move on so easily and finally be truly happy with someone else, is incredibly bitter and starts scheming against her. She gets Sky to turn on Water by either telling them 1) that Water is actually just playing them and is planning to/has already started making fun of Sky to others and stealing Sky's stuff --- that thows them into a hurt rage, leading to them killing Water on accident; 2) that to impress Water, they should do [something which leads to Water death, which Sky didn't realize until it was too late] or she tries to tempt Sky with the power of Water and her domain, saying something along the lines of 'trust me, Water likes to be dominated. Take it from me, I've been with her for [so-and-so many increments of time]' --- thus again leading to Sky reluctantly help Earth in killing Water. They are either way wracked by guilt, shame, loss and self-loathing; while Earth at first couldn't be happier, smug her plan worked out, glad to be rid of that pesky Water, etc. However, she starts getting paranoid and addicted to some harmful substances, all the while getting more and more irritated that she can't create living beings without Water, and realising that she is essentially useless without her.

Y'anyway- do tell me if that's too deep. Just stuff I've been thinking about.

submitted by Jaybells, Lost, ever-so Lost
(August 25, 2022 - 3:54 am)

First of all, welcome, Rora/Nut Le Squirrel! I'm so glad you're joining us! The more imaginations, the better!

I'm not sure where the tribes would get all the gold, that was just a random idea I had. I love the idea Hex had that the tribes/clans would have started crumbling when the gods/goddesses started to get angry. That really connects the normal people of the world to the higher powers.

Jaybells, I like your idea that Earth tricked Sky into somehow "accidentally" killing Water, whether by trying to show off to her or something else. If Sky and Water were in some kind of relationship, I don't think Sky would kill Water on purpose. Just my pov, though, so let's see what everyone else thinks. 

submitted by Flamarestii
(August 25, 2022 - 3:13 pm)

Oh thanks Flamie! You could call me Rora by the way. Pronouns she/her

So, if Sky killed Water, then maybe everything dries up, which leads to Earth's fertile lands becoming dry and ugly?

Then, Fire could come out of hiding because Water was keeping it from coming out...?

Question is, how did Sky kill Water? 

submitted by Rora
(August 25, 2022 - 8:02 pm)

Exactly! Bwahahhaha~

- Without Water, everything dries up, life can no longer flourish, and Fire rages as the personification of (now that I think about it) all of the Big 3's 'negative' emotions! Perhaps this can be pair with a diety for darkness/something similar... Then it can be used as an explanation for a historic natural disaster like a volcanic erruption!

- As to how Earth tricks Sky into killing Water... I'm not entirely sure, but that's not necessarily a problem. Remember, this is mythology, which acan be a bit loose, and even the most well-known real-world legends usually have differences in the smaller details. 

- I'm thinking, for Sky to join Earth in a full-out war against Water(I think that was the plan), there would have to be some serious trickery going on there... Like maybe Sky is convinced that Water is trying to get at or betray them, or Earth has a poison that affects the soundness of the mind, either making Sky extra paranoid in addition to Earth's 'encouraging' words of distrust, or makes Sky hallucinate/not realise who they're attacking is Water for some reason until it's too late? Just a thought, do refine/replace it if you have any better or more specific ideas, or we can't decide its alright to just keep the branching versions

- Ooh, ooh, ooh, and going back to what Rora said -- Water was physically and figuratively keeping Fire and what it represents in check: Originally she was kind and soothing and one to keep tensions and 'negative' emotions low, however, by killing her this metaphorically re-releases all those strong resentments she had been shielding, which causes it to literally explode out and damage the world. This could have been avoided if Water could have let Fire grow under her wing, like she was planning (maybe she was going to hone Fire until it was stable enough, and then present it to the world as the first true mix 'born' of the three together! But by killing her they interrupted the process, and the not-fully-tempered Fire instead backfires and is possed by rage/the more tumultuous emotions, causing it to act destructively, whilst also making it fundamentally different from all the others).

- Perhaps the darkness diety could even be the counterpart to Fire in a yin-yang of negativity! Darkness is insidious and creeping, while Fire is explosive and impulsive. 

- Furthermore, perhaps one of the reason the main of the Central Sands Civilization is crumbling is because of a lack of technological progress, since they refuse to use fire, as it is seen as being sacrilegious or scandalous or something because of how it supposedly "tore the gods apart" etc., etc. However, some small underground tribes believe instead that Fire was the last sacred gift given to the world by Water, and that it should be cherished and used in her honour, and as a source of strength and learning, not shame. They could metaphorically and literally opose Darkness, then!

Maybe that's what makes our protagonist special (If anyone still remembers, we were making plans a while back to have a protagonist who rose up from their small tribe in the underground passages beneath the desert into order reform/renew and bring justice to a corrupt CSC, yea?)

Anyway, now I'm kinda excited to start getting underground again... Maybe me and Hex and whoever else wants to can start diving into the ecology/plants+animals within this world? There might also be an opening for some ruins, artifacts/etc., and a tie back to the storytelling we started with, if anyone's interested!!

submitted by Jaybells, Lost, in my Mind
(August 26, 2022 - 7:00 am)

- OK, so I'm kinda in favour of a bartering system, mostly 'cause I don't really want to get too much into economics and stuff, but also because it seems pretty intuitive for the CSC.

- We could go somewhere with Hex's slightly apocalyptic spin, (perhaps that could drastically influence goods/resources available as well as the physical world?). Always nice to see chaos reign >:)

- I'm thinking that gold could be rather readily available in certain areas of the CSC(think Mansa Musa and his whole deal with gold), but it's less considered rare, and more considered... fashionable/blessed or something(think, like jade in China).

Any thoughts? 

submitted by Jaybells, Lost in a Brainstorm
(August 26, 2022 - 7:16 am)

When you go back and read something 'creative' you wrote just a couple of months ago, but it just ends up making you cringe- 

:' ) 

submitted by Jaybells, Lost in a Sea of Cringe
(August 26, 2022 - 7:03 am)

Lol I know!

Yup, bartering sounds good and pretty much everything else. You all have such great ideas! The way you put it that Fire would be the "last sacred gift" of Water was perfect, Jaybells! Okay, so I think we've got that part mostly figured out. Our protagonist will be using Fire to drive out Darkness, but they'll be opposed by that Darkness and the majority of the other people. They'll also have to come out of seclusion (being in one of the last hidden tribes) and all of the sudden confront all these hostile forces. I think when we actually get to the detailed story, there will definitely have to be some supporting characters to befriend the one(s?) who is going to bring out Fire into the wider world.

Gold could be rare and sacred to some tribes because it glows with the light of fire or something. Or we could make up our own sacred metal, like mithril in Lord of the Rings, ect. What do you think?

And chaos will reign! (In the story, you know)


submitted by Flamarestii, tomorrow's Saturday!
(August 26, 2022 - 5:00 pm)

This all sounds great! I especially like the fire-darkness yin-yang idea, along with Flamie's idea about using fire to drive out darkness.

As for gold, maybe it's rare and sacred because they're afraid of it and how it shines from fire. We could make up our own metal, although maybe for a different part of the world, because our desert people don't seem to work with metal that much. We could create something else, like a kind of holy sand or glass or something. I just don't think metal is that related.

Yay chaos! In the story or out... 

submitted by Hex
(August 27, 2022 - 8:16 pm)

Yeah, so it seems we should make a new metal of sorts... Lol that are too many things too make up right now.

If anyone feels like focusing on solving any of these, please consider chipping in:

- Plant life/fungi: Start creating plants/similarly functioning thingies and figure out their uses, symbolism, physical designs(and that of the several steps it may take to mature), role in the environment, etc.

- Animals: Same thing here; what do they eat, how to they reproduce, what impact/role do they have on the environment, what do they look like, etc.

- Other(misc): Diseases, crosses between animals/planta, sentient.... beings?, spirits, other supernatural stuff; anything you want to explore but can't really classify, etc.


Anyway, I should probably get back to reconstructing the CSS-language (don't be surprised if there are some changes/additions) and the maps, hahaha...

*soul leaves body* 

submitted by Jaybells, I'm fine :' D
(August 28, 2022 - 12:34 pm)


Ok, yea, so you can also make up new types of rocks/elements, formations, phenomenon and magical/supernatural inanimate stuff, basically. We need lots of that.  

submitted by Jaybells, lol sorry I'm a mess rn
(August 28, 2022 - 12:36 pm)

I'm obviously not a part of this but I just wanted to say that what you guys are doing here is SO COOL and I'm really interested in the world you're creating :D

submitted by Sterling
(August 30, 2022 - 10:37 am)

Thanks! Feel free to pop in if you have any ideas or feedback. It'd be great to hear from you.

submitted by Hex@Sterling
(August 30, 2022 - 2:25 pm)

Any ideas you have, share them please, Sterling! 

I'm wondering, what kind of desert do we have in mind? Sand dunes, rocky wasteland, just flat barren land? I always think of sand dunes, but that's just me. That'll influence the plants and animals that live there.

Also, are there any major cities/places we should name and then add to the map?

submitted by Flamarestii
(August 30, 2022 - 5:35 pm)

Yep, same as Hex and Flamie said, if you have any suggestions feel free to share; no need to feel pressured to officially join or anything, but we'd be cool with anyone interested stopping by and offering tips/feedback. Thanks for saying that, by the way!

* +10 motivation points for the week * 

- As for the desert point, I'm thinking there will obviously be several deserty areas with differences, but the CSC is located in a dune-scape. However, perhaps there are other civilization, legends/etc. that are in different areas if the same desert. Like, at least for me, I envision the middle-East(and the lands stretching Eastwards) in the real-wold as more dune-like deserty, while the bulk of mid and southern Africa and northern Indian subcontinent seem to be more "desert-wasteland" with their own gimmicks(such as Monsoon season, or the annual flooding of the Nile, etc.).

I'm also wondering if we could have a system of natural protection around the CSC/CSD, such as a mountain range guarding one side, then desert and/or maybe a body of water sheltering the rest of their territory?


*** In case you are confused about or need a refresher on some of our abbreviations: ***

CSC = Central Sands Civilization, a group of semi-unified clans/states/etc.(think Greek city-states, perhaps?) that span the majority of the Central Sands Desert

CSSCentral Sands Speak, official/unified language of the Central Sands Civilization 

CSD = Central Sands Desert, a large desert in the centre of its continent(currently unnamed)

Sorry for the similarity right now, we may change things later as things progress :/ 

submitted by Jaybells, Lost amid Far-away Lands
(August 30, 2022 - 8:52 pm)